One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

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One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#1

Post by one3powerboats »

This tiller set up powered with Yamaha's 60hp tached out @5900RPM, 32MPH, at 4% slip with a stainless 11P
Optional center console edition rated up to 115hp with standard helm. Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl8U4ufgzt4
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kmorin
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#2

Post by kmorin »

1-3,
great looking skiff! Neat double sides? are those air voids? makes a nice look of the little coaming continuing down close to the deck- goes with the seats/lockers/tank compartments.

Did you acid etch the skiff? Looks nice and clean of mill scale! Think she'll be a tad wet without external spray rail along topsides forward?

What about her bottom? what design? any pictures of her on the trailer or during your build?
Thanks for posting pictures of her- @ 16' some; did you get forced into foaming her bilges? Noticed the two big cast aluminum Baier-type hatches and wondered how that deck w hatches works if you have to foam the bilge?

What's your target market for your area? utility? fishing? (see lots of rod holders?) or other uses?

pretty lines, neat skiff, nicely done; thanks for posting.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#3

Post by welder »

GREAT post and nice looking ride.
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#4

Post by pjay9 »

Looks really good and so usable! :thumbsup:
2009 Raider 185 Pro Fisherman, 2005 90Yamaha, 2012 Yamaha9.9HT, 2008 EzLoader roller, 2004 Dodge TCD dually, 2005/2015 Lance1161
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#5

Post by gandrfab »

Very nice.

A little google-foo
https://www.one3powerboats.com/17-bay-boat
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#6

Post by MacCTD »

Great looking boat!!
'05 Pacific 1925
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#7

Post by kmorin »

Ah, Bill Lincoln lines? Response Marine design? No wonder she's such a pretty skiff!

thanks for link to site, G&R.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#8

Post by Craigb »

Nice boat, I've looked at building the same design. Its fairly small for a self bailing sole, do you find the sitting height to tiller height awkward? The sole would have to be relatively high for a small boat. Does it backflood in reverse or back trolling?
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#9

Post by one3powerboats »

kmorin wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 2:50 pm 1-3,
great looking skiff! Neat double sides? are those air voids? makes a nice look of the little coaming continuing down close to the deck- goes with the seats/lockers/tank compartments.

Did you acid etch the skiff? Looks nice and clean of mill scale! Think she'll be a tad wet without external spray rail along topsides forward?

What about her bottom? what design? any pictures of her on the trailer or during your build?
Thanks for posting pictures of her- @ 16' some; did you get forced into foaming her bilges? Noticed the two big cast aluminum Baier-type hatches and wondered how that deck w hatches works if you have to foam the bilge?

What's your target market for your area? utility? fishing? (see lots of rod holders?) or other uses?

pretty lines, neat skiff, nicely done; thanks for posting.

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Thank You sir!
Yes acid washed
NO not wet as the hull has large reverse integral chines, Modified V, Response marine, 55-19-10 degrees
Yes foamed for USCG compliant all above decks within inner rail liner/ aft transom benches. Lots of below deck stowage
This was a custom order built to suit. #2 is the same layout and will be northeast customer also used for recreational fishing/duck hunting
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#10

Post by one3powerboats »

Craigb wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:47 pm Nice boat, I've looked at building the same design. Its fairly small for a self bailing sole, do you find the sitting height to tiller height awkward? The sole would have to be relatively high for a small boat. Does it backflood in reverse or back trolling?
We raised the deck heights 1.5'' above normal to accommodate for up to 4 batteries, trolling motor option, and misc gear for hunters. The shimmed scupper doors perform well along with benefits of any modified V meaning the natural climbing effect as the forefoot of the hull (at rest) is the deepest point to waterline. The keel of the boat is angled upward
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#11

Post by kmorin »

one3,
first skiff has half pipe rub rails at the sheer but the second shows only a guard deck/gunwale plate/sheer clamp to topsides- weld joint? Customer specified detail? The half pipe will help some what to reduce spray in a taller chop. Not for helmsman! he'll/she'll be wet regardless if the breeze is more than a few points wide of the quarters, by the bow.

A skiff this size will be wet in any wave (seastate) higher than 1/2 the topsides to chine if the breeze if forward the beam. So, to knock that spray outward a bit more- so the skiff can 'run between' the spindrift/breeze carried return spray- that mid topsides external rail is the key. Can be done by splitting the topsides into another set of planks with a 2nd reverse chine joining them in a line fair to the chine and the sheer. But that is plenty added work!

So, if I read your remarks well- you foamed the topsides/sidewalls "tanks" but left the bilge free of foam. By combining the sidewalls' volumes and the after seat lockers volumes you were able to get by your (ridiculous DOT reg.s) requirements' volumes to float while swamped?

Hope that Bill Lincoln has a 20'-1" model so it could be built without the absurd and destructive foam requirements?

Also; in a following sea she will ship the top of a swell if slowed in a close coupled set of waves- due to the lack of 'slop tray'/full ht transom - as built. I notice that the design shows a full width 'tray' in the lines plans on the site? (?) so Bill Lincoln must have considered this a design element too?

I'd suggest that you consider a 1/2 length (fore and aft) cantilever of the engine - (tiller room) and a 1/2 length interior slop tray so the tiller is accommodated but you #1 don't give up so much deck space (tiny skiff= deck space is premium) and #2 you'd still retain full transom ht to avoid shipping any stray swells from the stern when you dropped off step in a following sea. the tiller is about 2' added to the cowling so a 12" aft mount w' a 12" forward try would keep the sea out, and leave plenty of room for the tiller.

Incidently; due this geometry in the 1970's and 1980's I designed, built and installed a "Tiller Frame for outboard engines. This frame bolted to the cast aluminum housing of the engine tub on the outboard engine, and extended above the plastic cowling to hold the tiller up about 2"-4" above the top of the cowling. This allows operation of a tiller engine while fully standing in the skiff; you don't squat down to operate the engine the tiller is moved up to your hip height and also provides a 3/4" 6061 pipe surround around the engine cowling - top and bottom. Worked like a charm for commercial fishermen who wanted to stand and handle a tiller and not move to a steering station.

After a couple hundred skiffs in this class (but mainly larger by several feet) I'm pretty sure she will ship water aft on the leeward beach and if you drop off step very rapidly approaching that beach? Maybe the waters where she'll be operated don't have much salt swell or landings on leeward beaches to consider?

still pretty as a picture! Nicest looking skiff we've seen a quite a while!

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
kmorin
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#12

Post by one3powerboats »

kmorin wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 9:13 pm one3,
first skiff has half pipe rub rails at the sheer but the second shows only a guard deck/gunwale plate/sheer clamp to topsides- weld joint? Customer specified detail? The half pipe will help some what to reduce spray in a taller chop. Not for helmsman! he'll/she'll be wet regardless if the breeze is more than a few points wide of the quarters, by the bow.

A skiff this size will be wet in any wave (seastate) higher than 1/2 the topsides to chine if the breeze if forward the beam. So, to knock that spray outward a bit more- so the skiff can 'run between' the spindrift/breeze carried return spray- that mid topsides external rail is the key. Can be done by splitting the topsides into another set of planks with a 2nd reverse chine joining them in a line fair to the chine and the sheer. But that is plenty added work!

So, if I read your remarks well- you foamed the topsides/sidewalls "tanks" but left the bilge free of foam. By combining the sidewalls' volumes and the after seat lockers volumes you were able to get by your (ridiculous DOT reg.s) requirements' volumes to float while swamped?

Hope that Bill Lincoln has a 20'-1" model so it could be built without the absurd and destructive foam requirements?

Also; in a following sea she will ship the top of a swell if slowed in a close coupled set of waves- due to the lack of 'slop tray'/full ht transom - as built. I notice that the design shows a full width 'tray' in the lines plans on the site? (?) so Bill Lincoln must have considered this a design element too?

I'd suggest that you consider a 1/2 length (fore and aft) cantilever of the engine - (tiller room) and a 1/2 length interior slop tray so the tiller is accommodated but you #1 don't give up so much deck space (tiny skiff= deck space is premium) and #2 you'd still retain full transom ht to avoid shipping any stray swells from the stern when you dropped off step in a following sea. the tiller is about 2' added to the cowling so a 12" aft mount w' a 12" forward try would keep the sea out, and leave plenty of room for the tiller.

Incidently; due this geometry in the 1970's and 1980's I designed, built and installed a "Tiller Frame for outboard engines. This frame bolted to the cast aluminum housing of the engine tub on the outboard engine, and extended above the plastic cowling to hold the tiller up about 2"-4" above the top of the cowling. This allows operation of a tiller engine while fully standing in the skiff; you don't squat down to operate the engine the tiller is moved up to your hip height and also provides a 3/4" 6061 pipe surround around the engine cowling - top and bottom. Worked like a charm for commercial fishermen who wanted to stand and handle a tiller and not move to a steering station.

After a couple hundred skiffs in this class (but mainly larger by several feet) I'm pretty sure she will ship water aft on the leeward beach and if you drop off step very rapidly approaching that beach? Maybe the waters where she'll be operated don't have much salt swell or landings on leeward beaches to consider?

still pretty as a picture! Nicest looking skiff we've seen a quite a while!

Cheers,
Kevin Morin

I can tell you have seen many junk builds all done wrong! Tough sell!
I am personally not a naval architect or an engineer. I have however invested quite a pile of money into designs backed by 30+ years of design. Yes, unless I was deceived this 17 is USCG legal! I have no desire to recall anything out the door! Yes I offer a 20 for customers that don't want foam. Some customers don't have the 20ft budget and accept the compromise. Yup the foam sucks and destroys boats. We did everything necessary to keep it out of the bilge.

All I can testify to are the 6 one off custom hulls I have had him design for my business. Each performing exactly as expected. I will also add I have hired others and been left with un-buildable plans due to lack of plate construction knowledge. I invest quit a bit of money paying for CAD designs to specifically avoid an surprises such as waterline, hp, center of gravity ect... I you would like to refer a naval architect please do. 401-864-7267

As far as the wet I hope this video can easy some of your concern. The customer is very satisfied and my goal as a builder is to build larger vessels so I'm not sweating it. I have been for maiden voyage only. I would consider myself a boat person. As the son of an offshore lobsterman along with gained benefits from several hundred test runs while working as a marine technician though out the years I feel I have strong education of hull designs and their intended performance. Performance meaning personal opinion. I would not refer to it as a wet ride. As we both know with 30 knot cross wind operated at the wrong speed you going to get wet in any boat.
We are working on creating a drone video. I will share when available. Sorry to disappoint but being that I offer several models and each client has specific needs this model will most likely remain unchanged unless specifically requested. For all I know #3 will be a Center Console
This model was built to store in a single bay garage, travel Rhode Island waters, remain easy to trailer, maintain low cost, accept a tiller engine, and specifically rigged to accept the trolling motor and $4000 worth of lithium batteries powering it.

My personal thoughts are boats are tools. Example: utility pocket knife may have a phillips head in it however, it will never be a perfect knife or an excellent screwdriver.. You can carry plywood in a van or an SUV but its not ever a pickup truck.
Lots of boats have outboard engines and V hulls, however a work boat is not a fishing boat. Could you hunt from a work boat? Could you fish from a flat deck work barge? Yes but I can tell from experience shark fishing with stand up gear from the open transom of a lobster boat sucks!
So know what you need, more inportantly know what you don't and build what will work best for YOU. Ill Tell you what, If I ever get any interest from you neck of the woods I'm giving out your #!
I can promise you this, if I ever learn of anything being wrong, dangerous or just plane piss poor I will cut it up and start over.




https://youtu.be/U7xfiWuEc7E
Last edited by one3powerboats on Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
kmorin
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#14

Post by kmorin »

1-3,
Your post just above the video appears to be quoting me!! INstead of being your own post in reply to mine? Please correct the formatting? AS I didn't say any of the remarks you post under my "kmorin; wrote" header!!

I think you're misreading my intent and remarks? We agree foaming is a pain, but you did the best you could and got it out of the bilge- nice work!

The slop tray well, like you say, is an owner choice and its needed here most often, but not there- as I understand? I was asking what the boat was going to do- no disrespect for your clients' choices- lots of uses are different in different waters- and we fish, duck hunt, moose, deer, haul supplies of all kinds including building materials, bear hunt and every other use for a skiff; all in the commercial nets skiffs in this neighborhood. Probably because they're so expensive and bullet proof they're worth the double (triple) use- I do understand the owner is the 'designer' so to speak.

As to designs, I've said over and over- its a pretty boat and not homely and simply asked about various features, adding a spray rail to the topside isn't a 'redesign' or condemnation of anyone's lines! It's simply a remark about the results, like boat #1 having a 1/2 pipe at the gunwales and #2 not showing that external extrusion? Its not a change in design or finding flaws in the overall skiff; its just a little bit of extrusion to help stiffen the topsides hull panels, deflect spray and to some (not to everyone's eye) a style point.

Image

Image

Above is 25' Offshore skiff has a 4"x2" x 1/4" 6061 angle that has had the short leg trimmed to a variable 1" to 1-1/2" and the outer square extruded edge rounded using a router and a 1/2" radius round-over bit then polished a bit w ScotchBrite (tm) pads and stitched to the topsides. It works to do various positive 'things' to the hull's performance in a head sea. Suggesting you consider adding such a railing (some clients insist on 'clean' topsides?) is not finding fault with a skiff's design, it is simply observing the effects of various aspects of skiff hulls in certain conditions... no one (especially me) is suggesting you're not building seaworthy skiffs!

While I designed her for her owner, he decided "this and that" details, proportions and 'sizes' of the various elements this skiff. I would have done some things very differently- so I do very much recognize/agree/acknowledge/and believe you're constrained as the builder to what your customer wants to have you build. In asking you (the builder) about any given feature- I'm not attempting to assign you 'blame'/fault/flaws as a builder for decisions your clients/owners/buyers make and left you to build. Asking as a fellow plate boat builder, isn't finding fault, and a complete explanation can be a simple as "That's what the owner wanted".

Running in a mill pond, as the video, won't show if a skiff is dry or not. If the swells by the bow aren't at least as tall as the sheer- at the very minimum 1/2 the topsides (?) there's not enough pitch to see how her topsides shed the swell on the windward side. (video link below)

The video was taken in flat calm water no breeze, no waves; jon boats are "dry" in flat calm water.

A video of the skiff in a head sea, 15-20 knots of day breeze and 2-3' seas? Then you'll know if she's dry or not? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_nIx1qwosA here's a skiff in a head sea in a stiff breeze- w/reverse chine but no topsides rail- she's wet at the helm.

Sorry you think I was giving you a hard time over such a nice build!

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
Last edited by kmorin on Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: typo's and added explanations; image links
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#15

Post by one3powerboats »

I see know what your describing. I have never done anything similar. The extrusion half round rub rail is not pictured in the aft trailer shot because it had not been install yet. It was chosen to function as rub rail only not for any kind of deflection purpose although i guess it naturally would. This will be light duty rod and reel recreational fishing. This is what he wanted. Understood. Thanks for clarifying. I don't have a
lot of time to spend advertising and certainly don't have time to on defense protecting product. I have a very purpose built 23 coming out of the shop soon and look forward to sharing. Be well Thanks Brendan.

kmorin wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:53 pm 1-3,
Your post just above the video appears to be quoting me!! INstead of being your own post in reply to mine? Please correct the formatting? AS I didn't say any of the remarks you post under my "kmorin; wrote" header!!

I think you're misreading my intent and remarks? We agree foaming is a pain, but you did the best you could and got it out of the bilge- nice work!

The slop tray well, like you say, is an owner choice and its needed here most often, but not there- as I understand? I was asking what the boat was going to do- no disrespect for your clients' choices- lots of uses are different in different waters- and we fish, duck hunt, moose, deer, haul supplies of all kinds including building materials, bear hunt and every other use for a skiff; all in the commercial nets skiffs in this neighborhood. Probably because they're so expensive and bullet proof they're worth the double (triple) use- I do understand the owner is the 'designer' so to speak.

As to designs, I've said over and over- its a pretty boat and not homely and simply asked about various features, adding a spray rail to the topside isn't a 'redesign' or condemnation of anyone's lines! It's simply a remark about the results, like boat #1 having a 1/2 pipe at the gunwales and #2 not showing that external extrusion? Its not a change in design or finding flaws in the overall skiff; its just a little bit of extrusion to help stiffen the topsides hull panels, deflect spray and to some (not to everyone's eye) a style point.

Image

Image

Above is 25' Offshore skiff has a 4"x2" x 1/4" 6061 angle that has had the short leg trimmed to a variable 1" to 1-1/2" and the outer square extruded edge rounded using a router and a 1/2" radius round-over bit then polished a bit w ScotchBrite (tm) pads and stitched to the topsides. It works to do various positive 'things' to the hull's performance in a head sea. Suggesting you consider adding such a railing (some clients insist on 'clean' topsides?) is not finding fault with a skiff's design, it is simply observing the effects of various aspects of skiff hulls in certain conditions... no one (especially me) is suggesting you're not building seaworthy skiffs!

While I designed her for her owner, he decided "this and that" details, proportions and 'sizes' of the various elements this skiff. I would have done some things very differently- so I do very much recognize/agree/acknowledge/and believe you're constrained as the builder to what your customer wants to have you build. In asking you (the builder) about any given feature- I'm not attempting to assign you 'blame'/fault/flaws as a builder for decisions your clients/owners/buyers make and left you to build. Asking as a fellow plate boat builder, isn't finding fault, and a complete explanation can be a simple as "That's what the owner wanted".

Running in a mill pond, as the video, won't show if a skiff is dry or not. If the swells by the bow aren't at least as tall as the sheer- at the very minimum 1/2 the topsides (?) there's not enough pitch to see how her topsides shed the swell on the windward side. (video link below)

The video was taken in flat calm water no breeze, no waves; jon boats are "dry" in flat calm water.

A video of the skiff in a head sea, 15-20 knots of day breeze and 2-3' seas? Then you'll know if she's dry or not? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_nIx1qwosA here's a skiff in a head sea in a stiff breeze- w/reverse chine but no topsides rail- she's wet at the helm.

Sorry you think I was giving you a hard time over such a nice build!

Cheers,
Kevin Morin
Kenai, AK
kmorin
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Re: One3 new skiff 17'x6'6''

#16

Post by kmorin »

Brendan
looking forward to another pretty boat post. Anything you can share (here) about the build, construction progress, assembly is very well read and appreciated by the Forum's members and readers.

This part of the post requires no reply, and is just to encourage you to consider asking the designers of your various skiffs to allow you to build in the "hollow surf board" model. Even young guys who're still bullet proof, flexible and can crawl over a gunwale a hundred times a day and not 'feel it' (unlike geezers like me) - this method is worth your investment in time and materials and allows you to save countless hours, improve build time and weld quality.

Image

This Davis Jig, or skiff rotisserie allows you to move the beam that holds the skiff up and down in the pivots at the end- and center the load in the 2-1/2" pipe pivots. That means that in combination with the tension clamps on the pipe pivots- you can roll a skiff by hand, and it stays where you put it... so all welding can be done with the welder standing flat footed on the shop floor. Fitting can be done by just reaching into the shape- with the chines vertical- this is a shortened version for lighter and smaller skiffs like the 16'6"LOA you've shown.

Image

a closer view of the ends of the pivot and vertical adjustable arms at the ends of the main beam as well as pivot pipe clamp. Note the support end frame leg has concentric pipe to allow pivot to be higher above shop floor for wider chine sized skiffs.

Image
here, a little 14'LOA skiff is being tacked up mounted to 'female' bottom formers that are in turn bolted to the main beam of the shorter, smaller rotisserie.

Image

Larger rotisserie, longer skiff but the idea is to build as a 'hollow surfboard' - from the deck to the keel complete! All welded out, all about 12" to 18" deep and the deck sealed and air tested- without having to crawl inside and weld below your knees!

This is the deck & down of the skiff in my previous post. The (upper) topsides were added to the deck to (lower) topsides at the beveled and then air tested weld and the savings in effort was very significant!

Image

I rolled this skiff myself, the end verticals on the main beam were adjusted to make the total wt as neutral to the centerline axis as possible... then the wt is manageable- so welding the bottom, or inside or back and forth is very much a few minutes at the most to adjust. Talk about time savings!

Brendan; just an encouragement to a fellow plate builder to explore the idea of building on a rotisserie so you can avoid out of position welding, out of this world contortions (that you probably don't mind yet!) and the quality of the fit and finish can go up - just by allowing you and your crew to position every aspect of your skiffs to a position that is the best, like bench welding the entire boat.

I do have pictures of a recent 34'er that I've recently done with a friend on a rotisserie, so it's not hard to do and the benefits to the builder are very good.

Hopefully, food for thought. Pipe in the sizes shown is very plentiful scrap in our area- due to oil and gas production surplus of these sizes. You may have higher costs to build where you are but... once you build on a rotisserie? I'm pretty sure you won't want to go back!
kmorin
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