Let's talk "shop"....My Honda SAGA continues!

[JETTYWOLF]

1/12/08

Talked to "our" man Welder for hours today on the phone. And while doing so, I expected to get a call from Deonas Boat works in Yulee Florida...a mere 32 miles one way from my house.

Because on thursday I had an alarm go off on my Honda 225. The "temp alarm". But the engine was not running hot.

So as usual, I just went to idle and as it turned out the first time it happened I was in the middle of a phone call with a gal in Ft. Texas, that was reserving a trip. So...doing my best at multi-tasking, I went to idle, from a fast non-plane speed. And the alarm stopped. And I then proceeded to the boat ramp.

Well it happened a few more times on Thursday, again while fishing. This time with a customer on board, on a rather slow fishing day.

It was very intermittent. Once in awhile, it would sound-off and even twice shut me down to 1800 RPM's. But I had to continue the day, and just live thru it.

After intermittently doing this maybe 4 times. I called a Honda shop, my buddy has used. Real nice folks, but very far from the house.
And over a tank of fuel in my truck, now from start to finish with and without the boat. I'm now in for $60 getting there after the whole ordeal.

To make a long story short, after I got done talking to Welder today I call them back.

The service gal said, "I think we got it, it was your KEY SWITCH"
I said WHAT??????
"Yeah, the key switch", she said.

Come to find out when I dropped it off, she asked me all about the engine. And thru our conversation I told her this was the first time since Oct 18th of 2006 when it was new that it has been to the motor hospital.

I mentioned the scenerio again, and she said "is the key in the boat?"
I replied "yes, I can't get it out of the ignition.....so it's there"

"What, is it stuck?" She asked..."Oh yeah, and has been for a year, at least" I said.

"Hmmmmm" she said, as I could see her thinking real hard.

Well. According to the mechanic.

They had a bulletin on key switches from serial number XXX to serial number XXX...and mine was in that batch.

Plus, they had other customers come in with an alarm sounding on a pretty new Honda 225 just like mine. And they replaced the key switch, and the alarm never went off again. Problemo fixed, according to the service tech.

So, they got the old key loose. And then the ignition wouldn't work at all.

They just used a little lube spray and let it soak. The same thing I would do if I cared if the key came out. Which I didn't really.
Why do I need the key to come out?

So, the ignition switch wouldn't work once the key was out, they have a service bulletin on switches going bad, a history of replacing a few, and it fixed the problem.

BUT. My question is:

Does replacing the key switch, not only keep the alarm from false sounding, and the temp light from going on, but how the hell does a key switch make the engine drop to 1800 RPM's.......Is this key switch that SMART?

Per the service tech. They enjoy just changing a part, I'm sure. So I pressed him hard.

"would you think that a faulty key switch would have such an effect on botching up the electrical sysytem to the point that not only the alarm sounds, the light goes on, but the engine also goes to 18000 RPM's too?"

He said YES. He believes so. And believes that the problem is Fixed.

BUT....

Wants me to call them back on Tuesday when they are open again, with the GOOD, or BAD report, just the same.
Which to me, means a low confidence level.

He did say, the computer had no whatcha call its....""flags"" go up that anything was wrong, with the old or new switch.

Then they ran it on the ears for 35-40 minutes to let it really heat up good. And still no alarms or computer flags to look at.

So.....what a deal, huh?

Who'd ever think of that?

Not me.....and my PAPER WORK per who they talked to at the Honda Warenty dept never had with my home address, so I never recieved a possible warrenty buletin, said the woman. But Now they do, because she gave it to them.......someone dropped the ball?

Don't ya just love going thru all this BS?

-----------------------------------------------

The Saga continues 1/14/08

Okay, I thought and the last shop I went too thought the EZ fix was the key switch.........WRONG!

So today I go out and run the boat. Because I was supposed to take out the local Outdoors Editor from the local newspaper to do a story for Sunday's paper......NOT!

I drive the boat off the trailer leave it running as I park the truck. Get back in it, pull away from the dock and get on plane......ALARM!
Same deal....

The temp alarm goes off, the light goes on and the engine shuts down to 1800 RPM's.

I turn around get back on the trailer and now take the boat to a CLOSER Honda service place, that I've never been too before. So...with a little Q & A, I leave it there and now will see if this place is any better at what they do.

I'll keep ya informed, the HONDA owners of course....

425 hrs and 15 months old and I'm already loosing $$$$$$ in this so called "non reccession", and all the towing has already cost me $70 in fuel.

No matter what if you wanna play, your gonna pay!

UPDATE: (LESSON, to be learned, here)

It looks to be a bad water pump.....just got a call from the shop.
It $hit the bed, but would still pump.

I guess I'm on the every 12 month water pump schedule, now.

I usually am a DIY kinda guy......So I'll learn to do it myself, I guess.

Hope this was it. The 1st shop I went too never even thought about looking at the water pump, because it pumped.....Hmmmmm.

[welder]

Dave , yes , the switch does a whole lot-o stuff.

That little 4 light panel right by your key does 14 diff. functions but hey , the motor runs fine .

If they would just pay for the fuel to get it to the dealer and back you would have it made.

Hope all goes well on the water.

[JETTYWOLF]

we'll see.....I'm a fisherman, not an optomist.
I always plan for the worst, and if I get back and nothings broke, its a good day!

[welder]

Dave, just think , TROUT big TROOOUT and the rest will be OK

[JETTYWOLF]

here's what one of my "charter students" of the float-rig at the inlet caught from land today.....this guy does two trips a month with me. He was standing on land near the inlet and caught these and 23 others today as I talked to you, this afternoon.



He's got a great teacher....ME!



how bouts that shop talk??????

[Daddy'O]

Hope everything works out for you Dave.

I have heard those Honda motors aren't really that good. :shock: :lol:

Just kidding! Let us know what you find out. From experience - Honda will treat you right - from a car to an outboard motor.

Wayne

[NUKE]

Just a thought, I know your operation is a 12 month deal but up here we have a colder part of the year (WINTER) and during that time schedule routine maintanence like changing lower unit fluids and checking the impeler (water pump) for broken fins . most manuals recomend checking at regular intervals .100 and 200 hrs services and replaceing when wear is detected... but all you need to do is drop the lower unit and get an impeller kit about 40 dollars on a Zuke ? on Honda and drop the little rubber thing in the place that the old one was in and close it up re fill fluids . we call it winterizing it up in Maine ,I guess you can call it Floridaizing in stead . :lol:

[JETTYWOLF]

Yeah, we call it survival in the charter biz.

The next part of the Saga is as follows.

to reinterate...(for your comparison.....I mean all outboard owners)

1st shop: It was the key switch, there was a service bulletin on bad key switches. See if that fixed the over temp alarm.

Nope, it had zero too do with it. Got a new key switch for free.

2nd shop:

First hour it was there, computer check, no codes, but they did notice temps were high. Lower unit off, noticed worn plastic cup over impeller, due to heat...kinda melty looking.....

Next up; check thermostats. Thermo stats looking bad = replacement (2)
run, for awhile. Computer test, no codes, temp okay. No alarms.
Water test: boat to ramp run around for 15 mintes, no alarms.

All well and good.

But survival gets much tougher this winter.

Bill: $562.00

I'LL LEARN HOW TO DO THERMOSTATS AND WATER PUMP MYSELF ON A HONDA.

That makes me one good shade tree meachanic huh, I know how to do Suzuki 2 strokes, Evinrude 2-strokes, Yamaha 2 strokes, now I'll lean how to do it on a Honda.

[NUKE]

that 562 dosen't sound bad. it cost about 350 to do a routine service in maine on a 4 stroke.and my brother in Massachusets pays about the same on his YAMAHA 4 stroke you said that it had over 400 hrs on it .by my calculations thats less then 1.50 an hour on maintanence .seems reasonable to me . but preventative maintanence might be more cost per hour of use initialy but down time can be scheduled so as not to interfear with your charters. Most engine Mfc. recomend impeller replacement at 300 hs or less to avoid parts failure that could cause more serious engine damage due to overheating . I glad that you got it squared away though !And now you can recognize the symptyms of a damaged impeller .your rating as a backyard mechanic has been officialy raised to part time grease monkey :lol:

[JETTYWOLF]

Ya got that right......

The reason for this entire post wasn't that I do no maintenance and then LITTLE GIRL about repairs, it was the SAGA

First repair place gave me a key switch and sent me on my way....
second one did what a real shop is supposed to do.

But, I have always got two years or so out of a water pump, and have never replaced a t-stat in any engine (except ones that blew-up and received new power heads of course....) Usually 2 strokes that each time had a LACK of lubrication problem, as most do and will, eventually. It's just a matter of time, with those thangs.

So I was a bit shocked at first, at the sight of those t-stats. They were not looking good. I flush her and powder her bottom, even....hahahahah.... :lol:

Especially that the first shop......70 miles round trip from my house. Did such a POOR evaluation of the problem, which was hard to detect, because the engine was seemingly being cooled just fine.

But dealer #2, took the time to do a temp test also, and quoted to me that the engine was running something like 18 degrees over normal, even though the pee stream wasn't hot.

Oh well....this Greez Monkey is up and running now. :P