Push pull gun ?

[fowlwaters]

Can anyone tell me about a push pull gun for welding al. I have a spoolgun on a miller 210 just looking for something to get in tight places.

[gandrfab]

On a push pull gun you won't have the spool of wire
that will help some with tight places

I have not used one that is like the steel mig gun with
a bent nozzle that might be something to look into

[Chaps]

If you use a regular torch with your internal wire feed system you can often feed the stiffer alloy wire. There are liners and feed rollers you can get to assist in running aluminum this way as well but it has to be a short torch assy. and you have to keep the cable really straight from the machine to the work.

[fowlwaters]

Yes I have a small 130 amp. machine that I can weld al. with that does not have a spoolgun just use the regular mig gun but I have to change argon bottles. I was hopeing to not have to change but after I have seen the price on the push pull guns I am ok with changing the bottles. A push pull would run $1800.00 the spoolgun is only $650. I only paid $1000 for the miller 210 with spoolgun and reg. mig gun bought it used.

[Bullshipper]

tig welding will fit into very tight places, and is probably the way to go on limited small areas. This technique, combined with you spool gun for the wide open spaces, shpuld get the job done I would think.

[kmorin]

fowlwaters,

The spool gun is pistol grip style with the motor in the handle and the wire drive held in you fist while its at right angles to your forearm. The pushpull gun's motor is laying parallel to your arm (except the old King Cobra) so the torch body or grip is like your hand wrapped around a shovel handle.

Besides being more compact and having much less head clearance to reach into tight places the feel of the push/pull is different than the pistol grip style. I find it easier to attain better consistency (well I'm old and shaky anyway, but...) with the push pull style MIG torch.

Of course there is the cost difference which is most often justified by welding long hours. If you're only welding a little while at a time, not a solid 8 hour day- then the push pull gun's costs may not repay. On the other hand you'll find they retain their value if you take care of the tool. So if you were doing a one-off project you might buy (finance) the more expensive tool and then sell it to regain most of your original investment when you're done. This all falls apart if you use the gun and find out you can't live without it.

MK products makes the Python which was, until recently, sold by both Miller and Lincoln, and they also make the Cobramatic (old and new versions I think) and all these guns can be had in water cooled and air cooled versions.

I find one problem- if you need to weld long hours, thereby justifying the push/pull gun- why would these folks sell one model that is air cooled? I don't know but the water cooled torches are much less trouble to keep up as they're not overheating the torch end when you weld for hours at a time.

I like the feel of the push pull gun much better than pistol style guns and found it worth the cost because of the fatigue factor in using the Spoolmatic style. Push/pull's will reach into very tight spots, they're like an extension of your arm.

cheers,
kmorin

[welder]

Now that my friends is how one man builds a fuel tank.

K , I would like to visit your shop and see your work.

GREAT post , keep it up.

[Sculpin]

fowlwaters,

The spool gun is pistol grip style with the motor in the handle and the wire drive held in you fist while its at right angles to your forearm. The pushpull gun's motor is laying parallel to your arm (except the old King Cobra) so the torch body or grip is like your hand wrapped around a shovel handle.

Besides being more compact and having much less head clearance to reach into tight places the feel of the push/pull is different than the pistol grip style. I find it easier to attain better consistency (well I'm old and shaky anyway, but...) with the push pull style MIG torch.

Of course there is the cost difference which is most often justified by welding long hours. If you're only welding a little while at a time, not a solid 8 hour day- then the push pull gun's costs may not repay. On the other hand you'll find they retain their value if you take care of the tool. So if you were doing a one-off project you might buy (finance) the more expensive tool and then sell it to regain most of your original investment when you're done. This all falls apart if you use the gun and find out you can't live without it.

MK products makes the Python which was, until recently, sold by both Miller and Lincoln, and they also make the Cobramatic (old and new versions I think) and all these guns can be had in water cooled and air cooled versions.

I find one problem- if you need to weld long hours, thereby justifying the push/pull gun- why would these folks sell one model that is air cooled? I don't know but the water cooled torches are much less trouble to keep up as they're not overheating the torch end when you weld for hours at a time.

I like the feel of the push pull gun much better than pistol style guns and found it worth the cost because of the fatigue factor in using the Spoolmatic style. Push/pull's will reach into very tight spots, they're like an extension of your arm.

cheers,
kmorin

What he said. Awesome post man.
We don't run any push pulls in our shop at the moment but I test drove the Miller unit at a demo show and was real impressed with it.

[warthog5]

You guys got me doing research on this stuff now. Cha-ching $$$$$. :)

[hakl]

Am using a Fronius water cooled push-pull torch 10 m.
270 Amp Fronius/Castolin machine, pulsing and start/end features for Al
Wire is AlMg4,5Mn

The machine had to be enhance by a control unit to run the PP.

I like it very much, no wire problems, no tip problems, very clean welding.
The pistol grip is also a more healthy feature to my wrist.
you may turn the muzzle up or down (if it would be gas cooled in all directions).
Got beside the curved muzzle, a short straight one, for overhead welding.