V1925 water in hull

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dingahling
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V1925 water in hull

#1

Post by dingahling »

I've got an early hull of the Pacific V1925 that I bought used a few years ago.
I''ve only been out twice this year and I noticed that it was feeling sluggish, especially on the holeshot.
Once on a plane, things seemed fine but falling off a plane at slower speeds brought the bow up in a way I didn't remember it doing. At first I thought it was engine issues, but then slowly dawned on me that it was water in the hull. My model has a sealed/all welded deck, so I can't figure out how water would get below deck. I also trailer it, so she doesn't sit in the water...
I see no obvious cracks in the welds anywhere - I did , however, once roll her off the trailer in shallower water than I should have and the rear lip of the boat scraped on the concrete ramp a bit. But the area seems fine, and if there were a penetration there, it would seem that there would be water dripping there once on the trailer.

So, 2 questions: What is the best way to remove the drain plug ( it's a yr 2000 hull and I'm sure it's never been removed) ?

and : any ideas on how I can check for cracks/penetrations of the hull that would allow alot of water in (guesstimating 40 gallons + by how BACK SIDE heavy she is and how she sits in the water) ?

ANY help/advice is hugely appreciated...
MacCTD
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#2

Post by MacCTD »

Spray the drain plug with something like PB Blaster, it should help to free it if it is corroded. What type of trailer do you have? If it is bunk with carpet you may have corrosion issues on the bottom of the hull where it sits on the bunks, that could be a cause of water if it is really bad.
There are not access hatches on the deck of your boat you can open and see inside?
'05 Pacific 1925
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dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#3

Post by dingahling »

Thanks for the quick reply.

Should I use a impact hammer wrench to try and free the plug, or is it too soft an alloy (i assume it's aluminum) to be heavy handed with ? I've never seen PB Blaster, but I'll ask for it...

There's an Armstrong(?) hatch for the gas tank which I'm about to open, but that's the only one
The boat sits on rollers so corrosion isn't an issue, is it?
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#4

Post by MacCTD »

dingahling wrote:Thanks for the quick reply.

Should I use a impact hammer wrench to try and free the plug, or is it too soft an alloy (i assume it's aluminum) to be heavy handed with ? I've never seen PB Blaster, but I'll ask for it...

There's an Armstrong(?) hatch for the gas tank which I'm about to open, but that's the only one
The boat sits on rollers so corrosion isn't an issue, is it?

Should not need a impact hammer, I am assuming the plug is about 1/2" in diameter allen head plug. Hopefully you can see something when you open the armstrong hatch.
If it is a roller trailer you should not have any issue with corrosion.
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JETTYWOLF
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#5

Post by JETTYWOLF »

There's no way to look down in the hull?

Don't use and impact on that plug cuz you really don't want to mess that up.

Every once in awhile I take my shop vac hose and suck out any water build up in my hull. It works great. I never mess with that drain plug, ever.

Yeah.....open that Armstrong hatch and take a look behind the gas tank if ya can. Seems as if you have many avenues to go look at.

If I had only two trips in 3/4's of a year, I'd be also looking at the engine. If it's a 2 stroker its a "USE IT, OR LOOSE IT" situation. Kinda like a weed eaters first use after a long winter in BFE somewhere. They need to run. They don't like sitting up.
dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#6

Post by dingahling »

Yeah, on this version of the V1925, the armstrong is the only access - I was surprised reading other topics on this forum that there was a bilge pump in other models- the selling point of mine seemed to be it's sealed deck.

I will open the armstrong tomorrow am (making dinner now for the fam) and let you know what I find, but I'm skeptical that I'll learn anything from that - there's the question of where the water is getting in...

I don't think it's an engine issue as it runs fine and wouldn't make the boat BACK SIDE heavier, right ?

I'll be gentle with the drain plug!
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#7

Post by welder »

The plug should be Stainless Steel and I think it takes a 1/4" allen wrench .

My boat stays on the trailer out side and this year we had a 9" snow and a bunch of rain and one of my hatches is cracked so I got to dump about 15 gallons of water .
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#8

Post by SJD »

I have a 2005 pacific purchased last year. I removed the drain plug for the first time this year, looked like it had not been removed in a long time. It also was pretty socked in and difficult to remove. It is stainless steel, with an allen wrench fitting. I sprayed it down with WD 40 and let it sit for a few hours before trying it and it gave pretty easy. Then I sprayed the plug with WD 40 before putting it back. Since then I have removed it several times easily. I have never seen any water in the bilge, and have had no drainage when the plug was taken out. I am anxious to see what you find. Seems unlikely that a lot of water would get into the bilge without an obvious leak.
dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#9

Post by dingahling »

SJD,
did you, after the WD-40, use a hex key to pull the plug, or need something more substantial, like a hex wrench (or hex key on a socket wrench) ?
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#10

Post by SJD »

just used a normal quality allen wrench and it turned by hand without much difficulty
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#11

Post by AlloyToy »

Pacific's claim is "unsinkable"

By adding a bilge pump to the boats it doubts the "unsinkable" characteristic (sales point)

Personally I want no wires/current below deck for various reasons......

Glad you got the plug out, make sure you use a good coating of Tef-Gel on that plug before reinstalling it
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#12

Post by dingahling »

Ok, I managed to pull the 1/4" plug with little difficulty, just a allen key as recommended - out comes a strong stream of water.
After 40 or more minutes, I measured roughly 110 Gallons of water ! Which is roughly 800+ lbs ! No wonder she crawled like a dog...
The whole time I'm wondering how this much water got under the deck, and I still can't figure it out.
I saved the last few gallons to do a salinity test on, but it seems to be (yes, I tasted it) mostly fresh water.
The only through penetrations are the 12 screws for the cooler hold down(in front of the console), the screws for the battery hold down(in the console) and the Armstrong hatch.
I tarp my boat during the winter, but not so much during the summer.
Do y'all think it's possible for that much water to have collected in the 10 years of the boat's life (assuming the drain plug had never been pulled) ?
Are the welds 100% sealed or is there any porosity to them ? I can only think that when it rains hard and water sits in the stern of the boat (on my boat, the drain tubes sit a fraction higher than the deck, so it never drains completely- I'd like to think that this is something Pacific addressed later, but I don't know) , a microfracture in the weld allows a dripping of water ? I highly doubt this myself, as the welds looks thick, solid and beautiful...

Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, are appreciated !

BTW -I'm going to try and go out this coming weekend if schedule allows, and will see if any water collects during the outing...
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#13

Post by SJD »

I guess it is good to know that the boat still floats (and runs) with over 100 gallons of water in the bilge. Did you look into the armstrong hatch before pulling the plug? I would think that that amount of water should have been readily visible through the hatch, if not I would wonder where it was hiding. When you boat is stored on the trailer is the bow higher than the stern? If not the rain that does fall into the boat will not drain out of the scuppers at the stern. Also will not drain if leaves etc obstruct the scuppers. Standing water in the boat may be able to find its way through some tiny crack into the bilge over time..
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#14

Post by welder »

AlloyToy wrote:Pacific's claim is "unsinkable"

By adding a bilge pump to the boats it doubts the "unsinkable" characteristic (sales point)

Personally I want no wires/current below deck for various reasons......

Glad you got the plug out, make sure you use a good coating of Tef-Gel on that plug before reinstalling it

On a 1925 that is about all the water she will hold . They are adding bilge pumps just for this reason , A hatch goes bad or a raw water pick up hose blows , which by the way there is a ball valve to shut it down if a hose blows, The pump is just a extra .

Run the boat again and see if any water comes in and of course check it after a rain . Pull your hatch and check it for cracks.

AT, there is enough POSITIVE FLOTATION that the boat will not sink. :thumbsup:
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dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#15

Post by dingahling »

SJD- I did pull the hatch just after pulling the drain plug. Water close to the top of the fuel tank (32 gal. in the earlier models !) Of course I wondered why I never looked in there before, but will be sure to check often now...
The hatch seems to be in good shape, no cracks that I could find.

I always park the boat with the stern low, so that rain will drain. Unfortunately, my driveway is not flat so that the boat lists to one side, so that in combination with the scupper tubes being slightly higher than the deck means there's always some water on the deck.

Are the scupper tubes the same for you guys ?

I'll let you all know about the next time I'm on the water.
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#16

Post by MacCTD »

welder wrote:
AlloyToy wrote:Pacific's claim is "unsinkable"

By adding a bilge pump to the boats it doubts the "unsinkable" characteristic (sales point)

Personally I want no wires/current below deck for various reasons......

Glad you got the plug out, make sure you use a good coating of Tef-Gel on that plug before reinstalling it

On a 1925 that is about all the water she will hold . They are adding bilge pumps just for this reason , A hatch goes bad or a raw water pick up hose blows , which by the way there is a ball valve to shut it down if a hose blows, The pump is just a extra .

Run the boat again and see if any water comes in and of course check it after a rain . Pull your hatch and check it for cracks.

AT, there is enough POSITIVE FLOTATION that the boat will not sink. :thumbsup:

What type of foam is used? I am assuming it cannot absorb water?
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#17

Post by AlloyToy »

Is this the boat that is at Winninghoff right now??
dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#18

Post by dingahling »

I don't know what kind of foam for this early hull, but accordingly to Blacklab's Q&A blog, they use polyurethane.

From the blog:
"You also asked about corrosion between the foam and the alloy hull. This sort of corrosion is called "poultice" corrosion. It has nothing to do with the polyurethane but rather is a problem with "dead" unoxygenated water held against metal. I won't go into the science of poultice corrosion here but will tell you that the best defense against it is to not allow water in in the first place. We use a sealed,welded-in deck with no holes for hatches, heads, etc on the deck. We do not allow water in. Should water get belowdecks - we keep the centerline void where the fuel tank resides free of foam and thus any water belowdecks would drain to the bottom center and back towards the transom where it could be removed through our inspection hatch.

You also mentioned condensation - the amount of water vapor in the air down there may account for a cup of water when completely condensed-out of the belowdecks atmosphere. This water would also remain along the centerline bottom away from the foam."

so if I have that much water below deck, it would seem some got into the foam. We shall see...

And No, this is not the Winninghoff boat (whatever that is) - this boat is based on the east end of long island...
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#19

Post by AlloyToy »

Jack Winninghoff is a custom alloy boat builder on the north shore of Mass. He has a "20" in his shop now having some work done. Just thought it may have been your boat.....
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#20

Post by SJD »

The real question here is how did all that water get in in the first place?
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#21

Post by welder »

The hull is NOT completely foam filled , the foam should not hold water , as I said before, my 23 will hold about 140 gallons of water if ya just stuck a garden hose in and filled her up. It holds that much because the hull is not completely foam filled but it does have enough foam to keep the boat and load floating.

Put the boat in the water , pull the hatch and watch for water.
Was the hull leaking water while she sat on the trailer before you pulled the plug?
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#22

Post by AlloyToy »

Fill the hull with a garden hose and add some red food coloring and see if you see any leaks
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#23

Post by AlloyToy »

Also is the boat on a bunk or roller trailer?
dingahling
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#24

Post by dingahling »

The hull was not leaking (in any obvious way) while on the the roller trailer.
But I like the red food dye idea - I'll try that today and let you know...

Won't get to put the boat into the ocean until the weekend...
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Re: V1925 water in hull

#25

Post by BroadCove »

I may be missing something, but if the hull had water in it, then it's not leaking at any point at or below the level of the water in the hull (before being drained, of course). In other words, if there was a penetration in the bottom, the water would have leaked out when the boat is on the trailer just like it leaked in when the boat is in the water.

I've never pulled my bilge plug, but I do remove the Armstrong hatch on the "swim step" pretty frequently. I've never had any water in there that I didn't put in there myself (to test the bilge pump). Even if the hatch cover is cracked or was improperly installed, and even after 10 years, I find it hard to believe that 110 gallons leaked in unless the hull was parked so that water pooled over the hatch or some other access point through the deck.

I would take the simple approach for now and just check it before you use it. If no additional water accumulates, then you can chalk it up to the gods (or someone sticking a hose in there at some point before you owned it). If you notice water accumulating again, then it's time for more investigation...
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