biggest boat for a single 200

[Papagallo]

Hey all. Doing research and I'm definitely going with a plate boat. First off, I will be fishing in the San Diego area. Ninety percent of my fishing will be inshore, with maybe a couple of months of offshore tuna fishing to no more that 60 miles from port. BTW, fishing this far out will be done on only calmer days with some buddy boaters. Safety is number one, and we can cover more water.

I've decided on either a center console or a forward cuddy/pilothouse. If going with the latter I'd like to push the cuddy as far forward as possible for max cockpit area.

Going with either the F200 4 cyl 4 stroke or an E-Tec 200, and a kicker for trolling and for a safety precaution. Can any recommend a plate boat size that will haul butt on a 200? What might be my upper size range? Thanks guys, and this site is awesome.

[Boatpoor]

It all depends on how much the loaded weight of the vessel is and the hull design, but I would say 22' would be the max size for a single 200.

[Chaps]

Depends on your definition of "haul butt" - what kind of cruise speed you hoping for? A 200 can push a good sized boat if you prop it right and have reasonable speed expectations.

[Papagallo]

Depends on your definition of "haul butt" - what kind of cruise speed you hoping for? A 200 can push a good sized boat if you prop it right and have reasonable speed expectations.

I guess that was the wrong term. I meant cruise to and from the tuna grounds at around 25 or so. When it's "Lake Pacific" conditions, pushing it to around 40. As far as gear goes, just reasonable gear for me and 2 other guys. I'm the fat one at around 250, the others are around 180 a piece. Then a cooler for food and drinks, 8 rods or so.

I was thinking I'd have to be in the 22' range, max 23'. I just didn't know with alloys if a stretch to 25' or so would be feasible. The reason I'd like to go with the 200 max is the weight savings, fuel economy and reliability. Now, I've heard the 4 cyl's are more reliable than the 6 cyl's. Is this true? I guess by "more reliable", maybe I should say a "more proven track record". Arrrrrgh! Too many choices and too many reviews online.

Another thing, would a 15 horse kicker suffice for a limp-in-to-port motor in case the big outboard takes a dump?

[Chaps]

I'd venture that a V6 is going to handle the variations in load and sea conditions on the kind of boat you are thinking about better than a equal horsepower 4 cylinder. On the 15 kicker you won't gain much over an 8 hp speedwise on an emergency get-home and you will be adding back all the weight you saved buying the 4 cyl main engine. There are a lot of options for sure . . . remember that most reliability issues on new engines have more to do with how the engine was rigged and installed. If your fuel system, steering and wiring are done properly during the build you'll likely never need the kicker unless you are using it for trolling.

[welder]

Pacific 23

[Napa Mike]

We should ask the Wooldridge guys if they have ever rigged one of their 23 offshore pilot house boats with a 200. I like the 23 they have--with the walkthrough window in the cuddy.

[kmorin]

Papagallo, the question is basically a simple math question that can be answered by a fee and membership site called BoatDiesel.com where, for a fee, you can use their calculators to determine props, speed, engines, and the like. I've always considered my many years of membership there, like I do my annual contributions here, some of the 'best' uses of my dollars.

Here, we get a forum to discuss many topics, and Welder see's to it, that there are many welded boat people here to try to help discuss these boats; there, you get to use the online calculators to get a sense of where to begin your future boat's many calculations.

Your question implies you're going to spend plural thousands of dollars; so (I'd say) spending the few annual site fees is worth it to have a real world idea of what kinds of speed you'd get. You can't discuss much there in the way of welded hulls like you can here, but we don' t have those calculators here, so go get the calculations, come back here and ask around about the dozens of types of hulls our experienced members own and run.

First, find all the candidate boats, and from their builders get the 'all-up' wt./displacement figures.

Now, when you go to the calculators on boatdiesel.com you can approximate the performance of these boats in real world calculations with different engines and hull's characteristics. You'll have to describe the boat in the calculators but it will return very close real world data.

Last but not least; if I were going to plan to buy a new welded boat, I'd ask my builders to set up a list of customers (three) for me to interview by phone. I'd ask them to take time to introduce me, to organize the time for previous clients to explain that a new potential owner would be calling to ask about engine performance on a given hull.

If you're about to feed the economy, there may be some information available to insure your decision in 'investing in the infrastructure of the welded boat resource community' is well founded?

cheers,
Kevin Morin

[jj225]

Depends on your definition of "haul butt" - what kind of cruise speed you hoping for? A 200 can push a good sized boat if you prop it right and have reasonable speed expectations.

I guess that was the wrong term. I meant cruise to and from the tuna grounds at around 25 or so. When it's "Lake Pacific" conditions, pushing it to around 40. As far as gear goes, just reasonable gear for me and 2 other guys. I'm the fat one at around 250, the others are around 180 a piece. Then a cooler for food and drinks, 8 rods or so.

I was thinking I'd have to be in the 22' range, max 23'. I just didn't know with alloys if a stretch to 25' or so would be feasible. The reason I'd like to go with the 200 max is the weight savings, fuel economy and reliability. Now, I've heard the 4 cyl's are more reliable than the 6 cyl's. Is this true? I guess by "more reliable", maybe I should say a "more proven track record". Arrrrrgh! Too many choices and too many reviews online.

Another thing, would a 15 horse kicker suffice for a limp-in-to-port motor in case the big outboard takes a dump?

Unless you're going to use that kicker for trolling (and there ain't much to troll for at that speed out of S.D.) I personally wouldn't bother with it. Just get Vessel Assist Gold Card. I've been towed back to S.I. from about 73nm out. If we had a kicker it wouldn't of gotten us in any faster. You'll be lucky to do 5knots depending on wind and swell, current and weight of the boat. If you're worried about turning the boat into the swell get a drift sock. They work really well.

I had Grant spec me out a 21' Pilot House and he said the 200hp motor would be more than enough.

[Papagallo]

I do lots of slow-trolling with sardines / mini macs around Coronado Islands and the local kelp beds. That's why I was thinking of the kicker. Also wanted to have something, anything, that I could limp in on. Also expanding my HP range to up to 250.

Speaking of engines...

Evinrude H.O. V6 at 225-250 HP comes in at 515 lbs. The E-tec V6 250 comes in at 524-530 depending on shaft length. What is the difference between these two engines. The displacement difference is 10 cu. in. Other than that, is there a reliability difference when it comes to a saltwater application/environment? Not much is said on the Evinrude site.

Yamaha's 4.2L 250 is lookin good, but how does it compare to the 3.3L 250 quality wise or in real world reviews?

I know that a jump up in HP can expand my boat sizing, so any personal experiences you may have with any of these outboards on your boats would be much appreciated. Thanks!

[BroadCove]

Responding to your updated specs - going up to a 250. I have a Pacific 26' hard top center console with a Suzuki 250 hp turning a 3 blade 151/4" diameter, 19" pitch prop. Unpainted bottom, pretty clean. I was just out this weekend with four adults, six kids (9-15 yrs) and two large dogs. That's a fairly standard load for me. I have two sweet spots where I cruise. At 4300 rpm, I average around 23 kts (25 mph) and 8.5-9.5 gph (about 2.7 mpg). At 4800 rpm, I average around 28 kts (31 mph) and 12-13 gph (about 2.5 mpg). Redline is 6100 rpm, at around 38 kts (42 mph) and 33-35 gph.

[THEMOORINGMAN]

I would never call a 22' aluminum plate boat with the wheelhouse pushed over the bow an offshore boat. I'd call it a back breaker / sea sick machine. Do the center console, but even at that....... Have you ever owned/been offshore on a light weight aluminum plate boat?

You're also working this equation backwards, don't start with the motor, start with the boat.

You're going to have $90k into a pond fishing machine.

[Papagallo]

I would never call a 22' aluminum plate boat with the wheelhouse pushed over the bow an offshore boat. I'd call it a back breaker / sea sick machine. Do the center console, but even at that....... Have you ever owned/been offshore on a light weight aluminum plate boat?

You're also working this equation backwards, don't start with the motor, start with the boat.

You're going to have $90k into a pond fishing machine.

I've been offshore in a Pacific a few times, but those times it was really calm, so I don't recall any back-breaking. Thank you for the input. I've been in quite a few forward cuddy NON ALLOY boats, and they didn't pound all that much. I take it that there must be some sort of "loss of comfort" when switching over to plate aluminum? Definitely good to know. I really liked that Pacific that I was in, but was just weighing my options.

[jj225]

Doesn't matter if it's glass or alum. A boat will pound depending upon how it's built. I owned a Davis and since you are in S.D. you should know what they are. For those that don't they are a heavy glass boat built for hard core fishing and original design was for running downhill with a full load of urchins. Great riding boat. Well that boat will still beat the snot out of you going uphill. Talk about back breaking. So just because it's a glass boat dont mean squat. Don't get me wrong though that Davis is one hell of a boat. It's just that it will pound in the "wrong" direction.

[THEMOORINGMAN]

To go through waves you need length, weight & design so what it's made of means alot. If you're not heavy enough to push that water out of the way, it pushes you.

Do you want to captain a 21' aluminum plate boat with cabin over the bow and we'll race 60 miles out and back? I'll bring the contender and we'll see who stops first.

[peterbo3]

Hi Papa,
Drumbeat (in my sig pic) is around 23' & runs a 175 Zuke. Flat out with 75 gallons of gas & 2 guys plus coolers, rods, etc is around 35-37 knots. But to do that speed I need a really flat track. DB has 23 deg deadrise aft & a fine entry so with tabs down I can punch into mostly anything at 14-20 knots. My control station is about midships & if it is snotty my back tells me to throttle back. I have fished out of Long Beach on a 25' Pacific & we had to come back past Catalina Island into a NW wind of 20-25 knots. Slow & wet.
I cannot answer your question but my advice would be to test ride as many plate boats as you can. If you want a real forward cab boat you are gonna need a bigger boat than 25' with 200 IMHO.