Should I strip paint off my 23' Monark Vee Hull Cabin boat?

[MasterBlaster]

You could look into getting some marine grade Franmar marine paint stripper, it's a soy based product, just lay down your tarps get the boat level and apply. Let the one spot work through the paint so you can idea how long it will take to eat through and then apply to rest of boat, plastic putty knife it of and wash. There are quite a few strippers out there stay away from the caustic stuff. good luck.

[Ironwoodtuna]

I too like the ALLOY look!

I don't know if I am right or wrong in saying this, but if you blast it and you want to smooth it up to a shine, you can use a heavyduty 3/4hp buffer wigth buffing pad and rubbing compound, buff her up them coat with wax or clear plypro to hold te shine.

[JETTYWOLF]

Jetty, sorry for not catching the message list on top of page i'm a little forum illiterate. great site keep up the good work..

10-4, didn't know how else to get your attention.
Welder's holding "how-to" classes in Port O'Conner TX in a week or so.
Beer, and fishing provided, and no or slow dial-up internet access.
Thats the reason for the beer and fishing :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

C'Cmon........

(For all. You can opt for a seperate
window to appear when you have a
PM -private message, all via the options
on your profile page)
Thank you.

[welder]

I would remove the two smaller fuel tanks and the concrete ballast then have two larger fuel tanks built [ Like a 100 gallons each ] for below deck .

If you want to run twins or a large single with maybe a kicker , Oh Baby, you can run 4 or 5 days and not hit the fuel dock .

I'm thinking a pair of 150 4 bangers Honda, Yamaha or suki . What ever has the best dealer support in your area. The Honda's will match the boat in color

Any way you go this will be a GREAT redo to follow and we have some AWESOME guys and dealers here to help you out along the way .

[Bullshipper]

[quote="welder"]I would remove the two smaller fuel tanks and the concrete ballast then have two larger fuel tanks built [ Like a 100 gallons each ] for below deck .

If you want to run twins or a large single with maybe a kicker , Oh Baby, you can run 4 or 5 days and not hit the fuel dock .

I'm thinking a pair of 150 4 bangers Honda, Yamaha or suki . What ever has the best dealer support in your area. The Honda's will match the boat in color

Any way you go this will be a GREAT redo to follow and we have some AWESOME guys and dealers here to help you out along the way .[/quote]

Extra fuel is good ballast, as it can be varied in quantiity and pumped forward or back to help in head or following seas, so I agree with welder.

Your monark apears to have a lot of V which has its good points, and bad. If you like to troll and keep the boat moving forward, the v helps a ot. If you like to drift fish, you will probabply want to use a sea sock to keep her keel line perdindicular to the sea to keep her frm rock, or add more weight to help with this too.

Butt you have a fine hull to work with.

As far as the paint goes, no paint is easier if the soda blasting can smooth and fair her out nice. But alloy also paints nice, so don't get discouraged about plan B either.

[85MonarkVC]

yes, I am thinking about the roll with this hull that I may have. If I measured correctly I have a 20 degree deadrise at the transom. I think I have a lifting strake on each side that runs all the way to the transom. My water line looks to be 20 feet at the most (from my tow eye to the back of the transom is 20 feet.) My beam is only 8 feet. I won't know how it handles until I get in it and go. I have noticed that there are several roll stabilizers that are available. I am going to look into these. I think the strength of this boat is that it is very stable at speed.

This weekend I spent some time pulling out old hoses, and taking out stainless screws and bolts that are serving no purpose at all except to create corrossion. I had some kind of tube running from the bottom of the cabin and up the outside and through the top. A heater vent stack maybe? I have no idea. It was to the left of my back door. It unbolted and was easy to take off.

John

[kmorin]

85MonarkVC,

I had only been able to glance at this topic's discussion since I've been hanging around the AAB.com but there seem to be some points that haven't been made, I think they were sort of mentioned in passing but I'd like to just make statements outright so you can weigh them.

Of course I'm spending your money like water with my keyboard and we both know I won't feel that cost; so I understand well if you decide these ideas aren't worth the space they take up on your monitor.

First I'd strip ALL that paint using chemical stripper from the Home 'Train Station' store and I'd concentrate on small patches to 'survey' the peeling paint, areas of potential corrosion and to reduce the paint stripping to a number of "buckets" of glop to dispose of. If you use the 'real' kick butt toxic stuff it will lift any paint but if you buy the wimpy 'greeeeeennnn' environmentally friendly stuff- it will cost more, take longer and you'll pollute the atmosphere with sailor-like language.

My thinking is to make sure you don't have some hull damage that won't show up until the paint is gone (#1) and to eventually get all the old paint off (#2) regardless if you repaint or leave her bright. One hour a night for a few weeks or ten over the couple of weekends and you'd have her stripped to metal ** ready for a realistic assessment of a repaint or bright finish buff job.

Also, since the paint is damaged beyond patching and repainting, you'll have to remove it some how based on your photos. The blasting method is effective but more expensive and to make any real economy has to happen in one big project or the rental of the equipment will double the cost of your boat's investment.

By using chemical stripper you can set the areas you want to lift and scrape it into a bucket and handle small disposal volumes more easily there's no noise, dust cloud or extensive piles of blast sand on the ground when you're done- to clean up.

After using chemical stripper and before painting you would normally use the 3M gasket removal hook and loop 'scotchbrite' pads to abrade the hull and remove the residual paint. This again is labor intensive but very 'doable' for a hull this size. Admittedly, getting between stringers in this very 'over built' (structurally) will take time and wear out your knees.

Making a very small blast pot is fairly simple and you can do interior jobs with it - sand, walnut shells, or soda will all work on this hull's clean up. A small 'spot pot' as it is sometimes called by sand blasters in the oilfield, just uses a ceramic nozzle for the bead blast cabinet and a home 117VAC shop air compressor to blast small areas. The paint stripper will remove 90 to 95% of the paint and you'd only blast the seams along the stringers where they meet the hull and frames.

Again, with this idea you're moving at a more controlled pace than if you hire a blasting Co. to come in and do the job. They'll make 100x's the cloud and miss details all over the boat because the size is so small for them to get a 3/4" nozzle hose into blast.

Once she's stripped (three words assuming a hundred hours of hot labor on your shoulders) you can buff her with one of several products to get an even bright finish. Even if you decide to paint in the future, you'll need to add and anchor pattern anyway- so buffing to clean up the paint removal has lots of gains for the restoration.

I agree the cabin was built too heavy and the concrete ballast was likely to reduce her roll moment but I'd pull it out to make sure the frames weren't corroded by the bars that suspended the mud blocks. In fact, if this weren't a budget breaker I'd consider sawing off the entire top house and rethinking that aspect of this 'icebreaker' hull's looks. Even if you just cut the cabin's forward panels off, at the aft raked line along the cabin sides and added a more conventional windscreen and forward bulkhead, she'd climb in looks and you'd add to her interior space.

I expect the tube line, you mentioned that was removed, was a gravity feed from a fuel tank on the cabin to a diesel drip burner heater in the cabin?

The hull looks solidly (over) built, the lines mean she'd run into a head sea longer than the engine or the body driving her could and the underlying alloy will last a long time if you clean her up. Tankage changes, arrangements being modified, cabin, deck and hardware mod's are all just part of the long life of welded aluminum boats.

Outboard or wing tanks along the sides above the decks will seriously reduce roll and are largely out of the way so don't reject them out of hand until you look at the space they'd take and see if they might help. If the hull carries fixed ballast you're burning extra fuel every minute she runs. If you buy that ballast three or four times a season in fuel used to push the concrete- why not consider adding the ballast as fuel and burn it at the end of the season?

Cheers,

[85MonarkVC]

KMORIN,

Thanks for the helpful reply. I have been leaning towards a chemcial stripper and I agree that the paint needs to come off. I have removed a number of vents, etc. and found out that the entire hull, sides, & much of the decking is a solid .25" thickness. I am very happy with this. The newer boats use 3/16. I found out that the tube stack was the way the cabin were vented back in 1985. I was told to find a good blige blower, place it in the tube, and connect it up and it will act like an attic fan and suck the hot air up out the cabin and create a breeze through the two front windows. The factory does not think the ballast is original, so I am going to pull it out (I want to inspect the hull under the ballast from the inside). It will be very easy to put back in if needed.

This project will take me a long time, but I am going to enjoy every minute of it.

John

[kmorin]

85MonarkVC,

1/4" cabin sides (!) and top is why the concrete was added, this boat will roll like a sailor's gait - in a beam sea. [Monarch probably just had tons of 1/4" material around and their machines were all tuned to seam and butt heavier material and they just slapped on a house with that armor plating- maybe they were building some gunboats that week?]

You do realize that 85% percent of the cost to build a cabin - after the materials- is the cutting fitting and tack up labor time? Welding is very little of the overall build cost. Even if you're not set up to weld alloy, you can cut fit, sand and tack-up very successfully with a very light duty MIG machine- which you may find at a fraction of new on Craig's List or eBay. Once the entire cabin was tacked up you could haul it to a fab shop and get someone to weld it out.

So, if you decide to build a cabin of lighter material, perhaps with a little more line to the finished look, you can build a plywood template on saw horses raising the work to bench height then make a small cabin of 1/8" or so which would get the hull's CG down a good distance from its current point well above deck level (estimated). Lowering this point would go along way toward reducing her need for ballast and save like crazy on fuel compared to pushing some concrete around on step!

By making an accurate base pattern on the saw horses in plywood and using dry wall screws to attach an aluminum outline base pattern- your 'foundation' or joint-line will exactly match your boat's cut line- where ever you decide to make the 'splice'.

Unless we include the folks with CNC cutting systems, aluminum is regularly cut, fit, and ready to weld with ordinary carpentry tools- all the boats I've posted here- were cut by hand and built one piece at a time with jig saws, skill saws and files or sanders to clean up the edges. Not much to do if you put your mind to it. Welding is more involved but it's only 1/10th the fitting time (not counting those folks who use NC systems).

Just a note, a boat this size in 1/8" with the framing you show would be strong as needed - 1/4" isn't double as strong- its more like 10 times as strong!

Cheers,

[85MonarkVC]

Sorry, I think I should have been more specific on my measurements. My cabin is not made of all .25 alloy. The bottom and sides of the hull are .25 thickness. The sides are high and the cabin sits 26" down into the sides of the hull. (So the first 26" of the cabin on the sides is .25. The decking that connects the sides to the cabin is also .25. The decking on the top of the stern sides is also .25. The aluminum diamond plate floor in the cabin and the stern area I believe is 3/16. The rest of the sides, back of the cabin, roof, and front of the cabin are constructed of .125 on a well laid out frame.

I don't think it is too top heavy, but it will help to remove the air conditioner on the roof. I would love to learn how to weld but I plan of keeping this boat as close to the original as I can. My next project.... maybe... :)

[Illgotoo]

85MonarkVC,

Sorry to jump in late to the discussion. No time for AAB or anything lately. Bummer.

Your new boat looks great! Real solid looking.

I have a 23' SeaArk VC that I picked up at an government auction in Florida this spring. SeaArk is the company Monark turned into as was previously mentioned. The hull was in good shape except for the paint and a couple of small-medium sized dents. SeaArk offers a refurbishing service which I took advantage of.

I towed the boat to Arkansas. There at the SeaArk plant I got the dents cut out and re-welded and new paint for just a little over what you paid for the boat. javascript:emoticon(':)')

Besides getting a good-as-new boat, I was able to gain a lot of knowledge about how the boat was originally built. The production manager and crew has been there a long time. They were able to tell me alot about why things on the boat were done the way they were.

[85MonarkVC]

Wow, I would enjoy learning more about your boat and what SeaArk told you. I have called SeaArk and talked to a guy named Ronnie in the engineering dept. He was supposed to send me some test reports and other stuff similiar to boats like mine but he never did. He was very helpful on the phone but never sent the stuff. He said my boat originally came with twin 155's. He said the design looked a lot like a group of boats they sent to New Jersey Marine Patrol.

My boat was made before SeaArk took over and he did not have any specific info about my hull ID number. The old MonArk records were transferred in the sale of the company and I have not been able to locate them.

I have sent you a private message about your boat.

Thanks for the input on this thread. It's nice to know of another owner of a boat similiar to mine.

[Illgotoo]

85MonarkVC,

I think it's great knowing someone with a similar boat!

I met Ronnie when I was out in Arkansas. Talked to him a bit. Willie Brennon is the production manager out there. I dealt mostly with Willie, although I think he and Ronnie are both up on what's going on.

-tom

[JETTYWOLF]

Illgotoo,

How bouts a few before and after pics for us.

You came here to get this boat in Florida??

Man this is great, two guys, two SeaArks/Monarchs.

Are you the one with the mini stabi-craft....quite a collection you have going!!!

I'd love to see all of them again.

[Illgotoo]

>>Illgotoo,

>>How bouts a few before and after pics for us.

Happy to oblige.

Here is the before picture. I towed the boat from St Augustine with the
paint slightly scuffed.



Here's the boat leaving the factory after refurbishing.



The kind folks at SeaArk let me take a few pictures of their finished products.



And a larger boat...



And still a larger one...



And a smaller CC.



Back to my boat. Here's a shot of it back in Massachusetts.



Nice job, SeaArk, on the bow.



And finally a shot of the deck.

[85MonarkVC]

WOW, I really like your boat! It looks like new. I think you made a great choice to haul it to Ark! Thanks for posting the pictures!

The hull design in the bow looks like it has been upgraded a little from when mine was made. I think out boats look a lot a like, especially from that picture you that posted from the stern with the guy airing up the tires. Wow, are you sure that's not my boat you had fixed up? :D

Your boat also has the optional lifting eyes, tow post, and engine guard. The generator also looks new! My tow post is missing but I found one on Ebay that I bought today for what I think was a good deal. It's tall (5') and I may have to adapt it to my boat. I want to set it up so it is removable.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Boston-W ... enameZWDVW

I think I need to stay away from Ebay. My junk pile and "to do" list is growing much larger since I bought my boat. :D

Please post more pictures and info as time allows!

John

[JETTYWOLF]

Man, that was one of those St. Aug boats???
S.L. Dave put up the link and I went and saw the last sale.
They had a nice C.C. there I thought, rather cheap to start.

Ya went right thru my town to get there, well.....nearly.
I'm not any where near I-95, and that's what we call the "west side".

Besides a paint job and dents, what else did the "restoration" involve.

What are you using the boat for? Look like ya got yourself a machine of some kind on the deck there. One more: how was the ride home, did the trailer stay together, or did ya bring your own?

BTW, this is a very interesting topic.

Thanks,

[Illgotoo]

Monark:

Thanks for the kind words about the boat. Mine is just a little ahead of your boat.
Yours will shape up nice too.

Jettywolf:

I only had the hull painted and the dents fixed. A couple of other minor things
were done. I got to see the structure of the hull of a partially built hull -- how
the stringers were placed, etc.

The ride home was fine. I had to watch for low overpasses and trees with low
branches, so I pretty much stuck to major truck routes. The boat rides high on
a trailer. Also it wasn't balanced the way I like with too little tongue weight.

I'll use the boat for fishing and cruising. It's overkill I know, but I just like workboats.
Don't know why.

-Illgotoo

[85MonarkVC]

MonArk & SeaArk Bow design:

The MonArk bow looks a little broader based than the SeaArk bow. I tried to take the MonArk picture from the same angle and distance as the SeaArk but I think I am a few feet further away. The SeaArk also looks like it has 3 chimes compared to the Monarks one. I have heard that these help with stability in the water. Does anyone know?

[Illgotoo]

Hello Monark:

The hull on the right (mine) has lifting strakes. It helps to channel the water
aft that would go into the bow wake and provides a bit faster plane.

Also what I have learned is that SeaArk redesigned their hull sometime in
the mid 1990's. The company hired C. Raymond Hunt to design the new hull
shape. So that redesign may also account for the differences in the pictures.

-Illgotoo

[85MonarkVC]

Found the info on C Raymond Hunt designs: http://www.crhunt.com/

Their info page on the design of SeaArk boats:
http://www.huntdesigns.com/comm_govt_safety.htm
http://www.huntdesigns.com/comm_govt_security.htm

"SeaArk Marine of Monticello, Arkansas builds a complete line of Hunt-designed aluminum commercial and military boats, 18-85 feet. All share the Hunt Deep-V hulls designed especially for the particular requirements of offshore patrol, law enforcement, rescue and reliable personnel transport. Customers include the US Navy, US Army Corps of Engineers, US Coast Guard, several state agencies and private operators."

Hunt also designs all the new Grady White boats:
http://www.huntdesigns.com/production_b ... _grady.htm

[Ironwoodtuna]

THey did a real nice job on the repairs and the repaint. What did they do in the painting process??? Tell us about it. WHat are you going to name your little girl??? Marty

[Illgotoo]

Hi Marty:

Thanks for saying so. They did both the repairs and paint on site in Montecello, AR. They sand (or shell blasted or whatever)
blasted first and then primed and then a couple of finish coats. I think it was epoxy-based finish coat.

She is unnamed as yet. She was brought up in Del Rio, Texas by the US Border Patrol, so maybe something of that heritage in
her name. Apparently Amistad Reservoir has a lot of submerged rocks in it. ;)

What's "Rocky Bottom" in spanish?

-tom